S4 Ep8 - Tim Burke
Tom Kelly: [00:00:00] This week, we want to welcome Tim Burke back to Heartbeat. Tim, good to have you back with us.

Tim Burke: [00:00:05] Tom, thanks for having me.

Tom Kelly: [00:00:06] How's your season going so far? We'll get into details, but just in general, how are things going as we reach that kind of third point of the year?

Tim Burke: [00:00:14] Yeah, so far so good. We've definitely faced some challenging weather conditions here in the beginning of the year. I know we're not the only ones here on the East Coast with that, but overall, we've been able to hold some quality races and yeah, looking forward to the rest of the season here.

Tom Kelly: [00:00:29] Cool. [00:00:30] Yeah, it has been a weird winter all over the place, but let's start out. We we talked to you here in Heartbeat a couple of years ago, and if you could just give us a little update on your role in athlete development with us. Biathlon.

Tim Burke: [00:00:43] Yeah. So my role with US Biathlon, my title is the director of athlete development. However, we're a very small organization, so titles are one thing but all of us do a little bit of everything. So I work very closely with Lowell and High Performance closely [00:01:00] with John Farra in sport development. But my main role is kind of working in the middle of the US Biathlon pipeline. So my main job is really focusing on those athletes in the middle of our pipeline who are coming up, ensuring that they have the opportunities and what they need to succeed in this part of their career so they can make a smooth transition into the senior circuit.

Tom Kelly: [00:01:21] Tim, you guys are a couple of years into your 2030 strategic plan, one that really looks towards sustained competitive excellence. Now that you've dug [00:01:30] into this for a couple of years, can you talk a little bit about the plan itself and how that's being executed across the organization?

Tim Burke: [00:01:38] Yeah. Our plan of sustained competitive excellence. So what does that mean? That means taking us from an organization that has occasionally had some success for sure, that we're all very proud of, but we want to have that more consistently. And to have that more consistently, we need to be more professional. We need more athletes in our pipeline, and ultimately, we need to be able to field teams on the World Cup, at World Championships, at the Olympics, where we can field a full team of athletes who are capable of stepping onto that podium. If we can do that, we will finally win that elusive Olympic medal. But it all starts at the bottom. It all starts with grassroots. It all starts at our clubs. It all starts down there building those numbers so that we have the athletes, enough athletes coming through our pipeline that can rise to the top.

Tom Kelly: [00:02:25] One of the things that has really struck me in the last couple of years, as you've started to add [00:02:30] staff a little bit, as you mentioned earlier, John Ferren, what he's doing with clubs, what Lowell is doing in high performance, and you run right in that very important middle section. Still, the three of you really have formed quite a good team in trying to work this thing up together, haven't you?

Tim Burke: [00:02:47] Yeah, we certainly have. It's been fantastic working with them. Obviously, I've got a lot of experience working with Lowell. We were on the team together as athletes for a long, long time. John is someone I knew growing up as a kid. [00:03:00] You know, John is a Lake Placid guy as well. And it's been great to have him on the team. John came in with just a tremendous amount of energy. Also a lot of great experience, not only from Nordic skiing, but from triathlon and para as well. So he's someone who's just very well-rounded. And it was great to add someone from kind of outside of biathlon, someone to come in with, with fresh ideas and fresh energy, and it's been a pleasure to work with him.

Tom Kelly: [00:03:25] How is all of this beneficial for developing athletes? You work with those athletes [00:03:30] who have found the sport. They're starting to move their way up. How does all of this work to really help them and provide them with a better pathway?

Tim Burke: [00:03:38] So it starts with just being more professional here in the middle of our pipeline. One thing we've done there, and since I've been with US Biathlon, is we restarted our junior national team program. So that program, I feel, is incredibly important for our best developing athletes coming up. And what we do with that program is really try and provide those athletes with. It's essentially a mini [00:04:00] national team program. So those athletes have a dedicated coach who's always there for them, ready to work with them. They have training camps throughout the year. But maybe most importantly is we bring those athletes together to train together, to push each other, to learn from each other. So, as well as a junior national team, we also have other programs such as our regional elite camps, our elite national camp as well, trying to build more and more of these opportunities for our athletes to to really bring them together, learn from our best coaches and [00:04:30] learn from each other.

Tom Kelly: [00:04:32] Let's take a look at the evolution of athlete development. And again, this has been really intriguing for me over the last few years to look at the different pathways by which people come into biathlon. I don't know that there are athletes who actually start in biathlon. Maybe there are, but it's we're starting to see different pathways coming over from athletes who have some cross-country experience. So, talk about what you've seen in the evolution of athlete development, particularly comparing it. To [00:05:00] how the sport was when you were coming through the pipeline?

Tim Burke: [00:05:03] One of the biggest differences right now, as compared to when I came through the pipeline, is we're seeing a lot more of these crossover nordic athletes transitioning into biathlon. And it's not only true for our country, but it's true for others as well. You've seen other countries have a lot of success, like Sweden, like Germany, like Slovenia right now. And we want to be a part of that, and we have been a part of that. If you look at our national team right now, if you look at the World Cup that just happened this morning, many of those athletes racing for us, racing in that US uniform, are athletes that came over from cross country at a pretty late age. A lot of them came after they finished college. You know, they were successful collegiate skiers and they wanted to try something different. And we tried to provide those opportunities for them in biathlon. And that's one thing that we are continuing to really focus on and even double down on. Here at U.S. Biathlon is making sure that we have a really [00:06:00] well-developed pathway for these talented nordic skiers who want to give biathlon a chance.

Tom Kelly: [00:06:06] Let's dive into that a little bit further. And I know that the three of you, Lowell, John and yourself, you formed this nucleus of, trying to build the sport up and give athletes the opportunity. Do you guys strategize on on how you go about with recruitment to entice athletes to come into the biathlon world?

Tim Burke: [00:06:27] Absolutely. That's something that we talk a lot about, [00:06:30] and it's something that's changing and we're trying new things. We want to get better at it. So to give you an example, before how this used to work for us, biathlon is there was really kind of a one-size-fits-all all program. So no matter where an athlete was at in their development, no matter where they lived in the country, what ski programs they were involved in, we had one program. If you want to be a biathlete, here's exactly how it's going to work for you. We've decided that's that's not the way forward. We felt like we pushed too many good athletes away with that model. [00:07:00] So we're trying to evolve now into creating programs that meet the athletes where they're at and really looking at each athlete's individual situation and saying, how can we create a program for this athlete that's going to one, make it attractive for them to give biathlon a try and two, not be too intimidating. Right. It's these are athletes that have they've called themselves Nordic skiers their entire lives. We don't want to just in one day ask them tomorrow. You're Berkeley. That's [00:07:30] it's a transition right. And we want to be there to try and make that transition as smooth as possible.

Tom Kelly: [00:07:34] Now I want to give a couple examples. And these may or may not be perfect. And I think these are ones that in, in a way of kind of bypassed your development system. But we had Grace Castonguay and also Margie Freed freed on the podcast a few weeks back, and it's really remarkable to see what they've been able to do in a short amount of time and making that transition.

Tim Burke: [00:07:54] Absolutely. Those two have been incredible. It'll be really fun to see what they do in the future. But there are two great examples [00:08:00] of of how we like to see things operate now. So if you look at Margie, you know, Margie is in Soldier Hollow racing at US cross country nationals today and really competing for one of those World Cup spots in Nordic for that Minnesota World Cup. And we absolutely encourage that. We want to see Margie there. We want to see her racing cross country. Ultimately, of course, we want to see her back in biathlon, but we recognize that Nordic is still something that's really important for her, and she should absolutely continue to chase that as well. And the same with Grace. You know, Grace [00:08:30] is skiing for Saint Mike's. I know she has a pretty busy schedule now with international competitions. I'm not sure what her carnival schedule is going to look like, but if she wants to go back and race carnivals, we're also here to here to support that as well.

Tom Kelly: [00:08:43] Yeah, it is really awesome to see that and it adds an exciting new element to the sport. You just concluded your very important trials events up at Mount Itasca. Before we dive into the event itself, talk a little bit about Monotasking and the importance of that venue up in Minnesota. [00:09:00]

Tim Burke: [00:09:00] Yeah, Mount Itasca is definitely an important venue for us. They've hosted a lot of trials events for us in the past, and we've also seen a ton of athletes from Mount Itasca, from the Minnesota area come on to our national teams and Olympic teams in the past, and I certainly think that's something we're going to continue to see in the future.

Tom Kelly: [00:09:20] How was your participation at the trials this year?

Tim Burke: [00:09:24] Participation at these trials was our best ever. We had 80 athletes competing there [00:09:30] in Mount Itasca. To give you an example, last year we had about 55 and the year before a pretty similar number. Those numbers in the past two years were actually tracking up a little bit from previous trials. So to come in this year, going from 55 to 80 athletes, I'm not great at math, but that's, that's that's a pretty big percent increase there. We're really happy with that.

Tom Kelly: [00:09:52] What do you attribute it to?

Tim Burke: [00:09:55] A couple of things I attribute it to one can't deny that this was also [00:10:00] the Youth Olympic Games trials. However, the Youth Olympic Games, the age range for Youth Olympic Games athletes, falls right in the middle of our youth athlete age range. So it's not like we were drawing from a wider age range to get these 80 athletes. We were drawing from the exact same age range that we typically do for a trials. But that allure of international competition, especially one named the Olympic Games, certainly certainly has a lot of power to draw kids, to come [00:10:30] out and try out for those spots. But I also think it's related to other things we're doing in development. You know, we're trying to run, more professional camps during the summer. We have our regional elite camps, our national elite camps, and those are limited camps. Those are camps that we can't just have an open invite for. We have to be selective when inviting kids to those camps. And one of the ways to get invited to those camps, probably the best way is to show up at our biggest national level, events like the one we just had in Mount Itasca to [00:11:00] go there, show how competitive you are and then whether you make a team or not, you still leave that door open for camp invites the next summer. I think having that program in place is really encouraging kids to to come out and show up and make the effort to travel to these events.

Tom Kelly: [00:11:14] Let's talk a little bit more about Mount Itasca. This is a pretty important event, and, I get a sense that Mount Itasca has a lot of pride in its venue. You in its facility. And what does it mean for a program like [00:11:30] that to host a trials event that is this important for US Biathlon.

Tim Burke: [00:11:35] It certainly means a lot to communities to host these events, especially a place like Mount Itasca with its history, and hosting this event before just one, one quick story of why I think it's so important for these clubs to host events like this. The chief of competition there, Carl Norgren, also coaches the youth athletes there right at Mount Itasca. And he told a story after the competition of some of his younger athletes. These are [00:12:00] 12, 13-year-olds running up to him after the race and saying, can you believe how fast those guys and girls were? Did you see the techniques they were using out there on the course? And Carl was thrilled because he could see that excitement in his athletes who got to witness, you know, the best junior athletes in the country. They're racing in their hometown. And not only is that great for the organizers, but it's especially good for those young kids who get to come out and watch that. And we certainly hope that inspires them to be a part of that in the future.

Tom Kelly: [00:12:29] I [00:12:30] think that's something that a lot of us don't really think about, but I know it's deeply embedded into your plan. But just seeing that speed, and I know as I interview some of the athletes who get over to the World Cup, Grace talked about this. Just the level of intensity, the speed that you see every time you take it up a notch. It really you need to understand that, don't you?

Tim Burke: [00:12:50] You absolutely do. And that's why I think it's so important that we continue to push to get these, get these events in international events, especially into the US like having [00:13:00] that having the World Cup in Soldier Hollow this winter, having two IBU Cup events in 2026, in Lake Placid. Those things are really important for our development as well. It's not you know, it's not just about building clubs. It's also about getting these events here to the US, letting our athletes see those. And I'm convinced if they're able to watch those events, they will be inspired.

Tom Kelly: [00:13:21] So what was at stake at Mount Itasca?

Tim Burke: [00:13:25] Now, Itasca was a trials event for a lot of different events for all nearly [00:13:30] all of our junior international trips coming up this winter. So we had this as a trials event for the Youth Olympic Games, where we selected three women and three men for that team. It was a trials event for our Junior Cup and Junior Open European Championships trip. That event, we selected five women and five men for that team and then for our Youth and Junior World Championships, which takes place at the end of the winter in Estonia. And for that, for that team, we have a total of eight women [00:14:00] and eight men. So, quite a few international trip spots were up for grabs there in Mount Itasca.

Tom Kelly: [00:14:06] A lot of those I know are held annually, but the Youth Olympic Games is an exception to that. It's every four years, and as you mentioned earlier, it's a very narrow band of ages that are eligible for that event. How does how does the Youth Olympic Games factor into your overall development picture? Is is a big carrot for athletes to seek to qualify for them if they if they happen to fit into the age band?

Tim Burke: [00:14:30] I'll [00:14:30] say this I wish we did the Youth Olympic Games every year because I think it's that big of a draw. When you look again, back to those numbers, having 80 kids, having that huge increase in percent in Mount Itasca, I know a big part of that was the Youth Olympic Games. So it absolutely is a big draw. Kids want to participate in that. They're they're willing to travel, um, to try out for those for that event. So if anything, I wish we could have more of them.

Tom Kelly: [00:14:58] And give us some Intel [00:15:00] on where the event is for folks who might not know this year.

Tim Burke: [00:15:04] Yeah. So Youth Olympic Games this year in Pyeongchang, South Korea. So, the site of the 2018 Winter Olympics.

Tom Kelly: [00:15:13] Are they using the Olympic venues?

Tim Burke: [00:15:15] They are yes. They'll be using the same venues from the Olympics. So, I'm excited to get back there and see if anything's changed.

Tom Kelly: [00:15:23] So what will the takeaway be? I imagine that in many ways, it's similar to what they might take away at the Youth and Junior [00:15:30] World Championships. But here you also have athletes from probably many more countries because there are more events. But what's the big takeaway for your athletes, your three men and women who will go to Pyeongchang? What's the biggest takeaway for them?

Tim Burke: [00:15:45] For me, my goal for those athletes, the biggest takeaway I want them to have from there is I want them to leave there just incredibly motivated to continue pursuing biathlon at a high level, and I'm sure they will have that experience in Korea. You know, to be there [00:16:00] at an event that's not only drawing the best athletes your age in the world for your sport, but to be there at an event where you have athletes from all different disciplines from all over the world is incredibly, incredibly motivating for these athletes. I'm super excited for them to have this experience.

Tom Kelly: [00:16:19] Who's the coach going on that trip?

Tim Burke: [00:16:21] There will be three of us, so I'll be on the trip. As well as Maddie Phaneuf, the head coach of the New York State Education Foundation [00:16:30] biathlon program, and also Garrett Gerberich. Garrett is one of the coaches out in Soldier Hollow.

Tom Kelly: [00:16:36] Were you there in 2018?

Tim Burke: [00:16:39] I was there in 2018. Yes. 2018 was my last Olympics.

Tom Kelly: [00:16:43] Yeah, well, it'll be a good reunion for you. We're with Tim Burke from US Biathlon. We're going to take a short show break, and we'll be right back and talk a little bit more about the importance of international competition and development. We'll be right back on Heartbeat. We're back with Tim Burke on Heartbeat. [00:17:00] And Tim, just to continue the discussion coming out of the Monte Tasca trials, want to explore a little bit more about the importance of international competition in development? I know everybody has, you know, the long-range plan of getting on the World Cup or getting to the Olympics. But in the development phase, how important is it to get out and about around the world, and what do the athletes take away from that experience?

Tim Burke: [00:17:23] I think the athletes take away a few really important things. One is, you know what I've already touched on with the Youth Olympic Games [00:17:30] is just motivation. Seeing biathlon at such a high level, I think, is really motivating for our athletes, but most importantly for our development athletes. It's a learning experience; you know they will get the chance and the opportunity to see the very best athletes, the very best biathletes in the world at their age. I guarantee you, everyone leaving one of these international trips will have multiple things that they learned from being there, whether it was being on course and skiing with some of these other skiers, or seeing [00:18:00] others on the range, they will learn things that they can go back home, work on those things and come back better the next year.

Tom Kelly: [00:18:07] I always like to look too, at the cultural aspects, the logistical aspect of travel. I imagine for a lot of these kids they haven't traveled internationally. So it's a whole new world. There's new situations on airplanes and transportation, and that's a completely different culture. How important is it to get comfortable there?

Tim Burke: [00:18:27] Yeah, biathlon is an international sport. If you're going [00:18:30] to pursue it at a high level, you will spend a lot of time traveling. So the earlier you get used to that, the more comfortable you become with that at an earlier age, the better that is for your career in the long run.

Tom Kelly: [00:18:41] Do you remember your first international trip?

Tim Burke: [00:18:45] Absolutely. I remember my first international trip was to Torsby, Sweden for a, um. It was a Scandinavian cup at the time it was called, and I remember being incredibly nervous. But again, getting [00:19:00] over there, having a having an amazing time and coming back motivated and really hungry for more.

Tom Kelly: [00:19:06] We talked a little bit earlier about the Youth Olympic Games. Can you give us a little preview of the youth and junior world champs?

Tim Burke: [00:19:13] Yeah, so the youth and Junior World champs will be held in Otepaa, Estonia. I've never been there myself, but I've heard great things about the venue. Um, and they've held a lot of, you know, big international events there in the past. The event will take place at the end of February and the beginning [00:19:30] of March. And it's it's a really big event. You know, in each age class there, um, youth and junior, you see typically close to 100 athletes competing. So it'll be really fantastic exposure for athletes to get over there and compete in an event of that size.

Tom Kelly: [00:19:46] This is the same event that was at Soldier Hollow just two seasons ago. That was a good learning experience, I think, for a lot of our athletes, because again, they got to see the speed, they got to see all of the best international athletes right here on us. Snow. [00:20:00]

Tim Burke: [00:20:00] Yeah, that was a great event in Soldier Hall. They did a fantastic job pulling that off. They ordered the right weather there for the entire time with the competitions. Um, and yes, it was certainly a great experience for our athletes. Now it'll be a little bit different, right? A little quite a bit longer travel a lot more logistics for me to work on. But in the end it still will be a fantastic experience.

Tom Kelly: [00:20:24] Are you going on that one as well?

Tim Burke: [00:20:26] I will be there as well. Yes.

Tom Kelly: [00:20:28] Great. As we wrap things up [00:20:30] here, let's kind of look into the crystal ball a little bit. You have the plan for 2030 that is in progress right now. You've seen some success over the last few years. Where do you see the future of athlete development at US Biathlon. As you look out over the next two, four, six, eight years?

Tim Burke: [00:20:48] Yeah. So, for me, it's important to continue to see this growth that we're experiencing now. So the question is how can at US biathlon, how can we work to continue to see these numbers increase like we have [00:21:00] these past few years? What opportunities can we provide that are going to attract kids to these events so they continue to grow? So, we draw from a broader number. Um, other things that I look at that I think are really important that I would like to point out from this year when we had these bigger numbers at trials, you know, when we look at the end result sheet from trials, it was really, really impressive. And it looked significantly different to me. You know, as a coach, it looked very different to me than it has in years past and years past. [00:21:30] You know, it wasn't uncommon to see that between, you know, fourth and fifth place in a race, you might have a one-minute time difference at these trials races. We just had times were really tight. Those races were incredibly competitive. It was so challenging at the end when we were naming teams when a lot of those last spots came down to three different athletes who were within 1% of each other and percent back after three races. That's incredibly close, and it shows things are getting more competitive, [00:22:00] and my job is to make that even harder for these athletes in the future. We want to see it even be more competitive in the times, even closer, and we need to continue, continue working on that to get there.

Tom Kelly: [00:22:11] I know that the organization has been really focusing on getting more women involved in the sport. You did see strong numbers at Mount Itasca for women in that trials event. Where do you see that going, and do you feel that you're on a pretty good path right now to expand the number of women in the sport?

Tim Burke: [00:22:29] Yeah, [00:22:30] expanding the number of women in sport is definitely a big goal of ours. At US Biathlon, it was great to see a record number for us in Mount Itasca. We had 31 women there competing, and really, really nice to see some fantastic up-and-coming athletes who I wasn't really familiar with before this trials event, to see them coming up through the system and doing really well. And again, back to the competitiveness of those races, that women's race for those last team spots, for all of the team spots, really, [00:23:00] it was tight. It really came down to the last race and it could have gone to a lot of different women, and that was just really, really cool and inspiring for me and everyone at US biathlon to see.

Tom Kelly: [00:23:11] That's really good to see. We're going to move on now to our closing Fresh Tracks segment, and I've just got a few final questions for you as we wrap things up and talking about athlete development, I want to go back when you were growing up in Lake Placid, who really provided inspiration for you? Did you have a role model when you [00:23:30] were a young boy that you looked up to and as a sport hero?

Tim Burke: [00:23:35] I think I got a lot of inspiration as a kid from my coaches, and I feel like I was really, really lucky to come up through the programs when I did and just have the ability to work with some fantastic coaches to that, a couple, I hate to name only a couple. There were many, but some that really come to mind for me growing up were my coach, Al Barrett, Chris [00:24:00] Seymour and Corey Semla at he was at us all the time. They were they were coaches that were they made skiing fun all of the time. I had opportunities to play a lot of different sports, and I did play a lot of different sports, but I always wanted to come to either biathlon or ski practice to to be with them. And, it's amazing what what kind of impact a great coach can have on an athlete's career.

Tom Kelly: [00:24:25] You know, we often look around the country at hotbeds of particular sports. [00:24:30] There's something about being in a community that has other athletes. And you had the benefit of growing up in Lake Placid in an environment where there were many athletes, not just from your sport, but from others. How important was that local community environment for you as a young athlete?

Tim Burke: [00:24:50] Yeah, again, I feel really fortunate to have grown up here in that community where, you know, athletics plays such a big part in this community. No matter where you walk through town, you're reminded of that, [00:25:00] whether that's walking by the speed skating oval, looking up, seeing the ski jumps or the bobsled run. You know, athletics is a huge part of this town and this community. So growing up and being exposed to that from a really young age, I certainly feel was was a big advantage for me.

Tom Kelly: [00:25:17] And then one last one, and I know it's difficult to ask you, you know, what's your favorite this or your favorite that. But as an athlete development leader, what gives you the most satisfaction in your job [00:25:30] today and working with all of these amazing young athletes?

Tim Burke: [00:25:34] Oh, that's a great question and a really tough one. It depends on the day, I think what my answer would be. But since this one is really fresh in mind, since we just finished up with team naming, I'll give you this. It was so fun to call those athletes that qualified for our teams and chat with them and let them know that their hard work paid off and they would be headed out soon on an international trip. Hearing that [00:26:00] excitement in their voices, um, was really, really inspiring for me to hear. And those are the calls, you love to make.

Tom Kelly: [00:26:09] When you make those calls, are you talking to the athlete or the parent?

Tim Burke: [00:26:14] Usually to the athlete directly? Yep. So try and call the athletes, um, let them know before they, you know, see a team announcement in a press release. And a lot of them, you know, they don't know what the final result was. They haven't seen the final [00:26:30] points list. So they're really not sure if they're on the team or off the team. So when they get that call, I think when they when they hear my voice, they're probably all a little bit nervous. Oh, what's what's he going to say. But when they realize they've, they've made the team to hear that excitement, that surprise, it's a, it's a special moment.

Tom Kelly: [00:26:48] It is it is a special moment. It's an emotional one, isn't it?

Tim Burke: [00:26:53] Absolutely it is. It is definitely an emotional one. You can hear in their voices how much they [00:27:00] wanted that, how much work they put into that, how much work their team put into that and to accomplish that, you know, at a, at a young age like that. Um, yeah, that's certainly something we look forward to seeing more and more of here in the future.

Tom Kelly: [00:27:16] Well, Tim Burke, we appreciate all that you do for US Biathlon. Thanks for joining us on Heartbeat. And all the best to you and your athletes for the rest of the season.

Tim Burke: [00:27:26] Thanks for having me, Tom. It was a pleasure to be here, and look forward to coming back, [00:27:30] maybe after the season and discussing all of these trips and how they played out.

Tom Kelly: [00:27:34] Awesome. We'll talk about all that success. Tim Burke, athlete development director for US Biathlon.